Subject: Digest for 7/16/98 Date: Thu, 16 Jul 1998 22:45:14 -0700 From: "XTension Discussion" To: "XTension Discussion" -> Telephone off-hook detector and wireless speakers by lists@matterform.com (Michael Herrick) -> Re: Telephone off-hook detector and wireless speakers by "Jerry Prsha" -> Re: Telephone off-hook detector and wireless speakers by Steve Fyfe ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Date: 16 Jul 1998 08:04:11 -0700 From: lists@matterform.com (Michael Herrick) Subject: Telephone off-hook detector and wireless speakers Hi everyone. I've just gotten started with Xtension and a couple of switches. I am trying not to let it take over my life but it's not easy. I shudder to think what might happen if I didn't have a wife to tell me to go to bed. Anyway, the software is great and I'm having no difficulty with it so far. However, I have some hardware questions I'd like to put out there. I'm looking for a device that plugs into a phone line and sends an X10 ON command when I pick the phone up and an OFF when I hang it up again. I've seen a thingy that plugs into a phone line and turns on a red LED when the phone is off hook. I suppose this could be hacked to a PowerFlash. In my copious spare time. Any off-the-shelf solutions? I'm playing around with wireless speakers, using appliance modules to control what rooms get the sound. My main beef is the click the appliance module makes when turning on and off. Does the lamp module click like that too? Could I use a lamp module on a speaker (15 volt AC adapter) without damaging the speaker or the module? And speaking of noise, the speaker itself makes a pretty loud click or thump when it is first turned on. Any way around that? How about dimming the speaker gradually from 0 to 100? Or would that fry it? That reminds me... any way to make my neighbor's stereo explode when it goes above 90dB? I'd pay a lot for that capability, especially if it could generate shrapnel. Thanks to everyone on the list. I've already learned a lot by reading the archives and I look forward to learning more. - --Michael - ------------------ MIME Information follows ------------------ - --==_Boundary-1_== Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" <<<<<< See above "Message Body" >>>>>> - --==_Boundary-1_==-- ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Date: 16 Jul 1998 08:09:44 -0700 From: "Jerry Prsha" Subject: Re: Telephone off-hook detector and wireless speakers - ->That reminds me... any way to make my neighbor's stereo explode when it goes above 90dB? I'd pay a lot for that capability, especially if it could generate shrapnel. Yes.. look in the XTension manual under "gas leak." The whole house would be schrapnel. Jerry - ----------------------------------- Jerry's Pond Page St. Louis, Missouri - U.S.A. http://idt.net/~jprsha/ ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Date: 16 Jul 1998 09:49:29 -0700 From: Steve Fyfe Subject: Re: Telephone off-hook detector and wireless speakers Michael Herrick said on 7/16/98 11:03 AM >I'm looking for a device that plugs into a phone line and sends an X10 ON >command when I pick the phone up and an OFF when I hang it up again. I've >seen a thingy that plugs into a phone line and turns on a red LED when >the phone is off hook. I suppose this could be hacked to a PowerFlash. In >my copious spare time. Any off-the-shelf solutions? Since you are reading the archives, check them for messages related to detecting phone usage. There were several suggestions made on this list around March 2 and 3 of this year. Most were for cheap ways to hack your own solution rather than off-the-shelf, but still worth a look. If you can't find the messages then let me know - I archived a copy of most of them. HTH Steve _____________________________________________________________ Steve Fyfe Windward Services Group (978) 386-7260 PO Box 340 (978) 386-7322 Fax Ashby, Massachusetts 01431-0340 Information Technology that Works for Your Business ---------------------------------------------------------------------- End of Digest To request a copy of the help file, reply to this message and put "help" in the subject. Subject: Digest for 7/17/98 Date: Sat, 18 Jul 1998 09:01:58 -0700 From: "XTension Discussion" To: "XTension Discussion" -> Re: Telephone off-hook detector and wireless speakers by Chuck Shotton -> Re: Telephone off-hook detector and wireless speakers by petitg@llb.saclay.cea.fr (Petitgrand) -> AC adaptors and Dimmers by michael@shed.com -> Re: AC adaptors and Dimmers by Phil Pedersen -> Re: Telephone off-hook detector and wireless speakers by Andy Montag -> new Xtension? by Phil Pedersen -> dim not triggering script by Guy K Hillyer -> Connecting Macs by Wedge@mindless.com -> detecting power outage by Guy K Hillyer -> Re: dim not triggering script by michael@shed.com -> Re: AC adaptors and Dimmers by michael@shed.com -> Re: Telephone off-hook detector and wireless speakers by michael@shed.com -> Re: dim not triggering script by Guy K Hillyer -> Re: new Xtension? by michael@shed.com -> Re: dim not triggering script by michael@shed.com -> Re: detecting power outage by michael@shed.com -> Re: detecting power outage by Steve Fyfe -> Re: new Xtension? by Phil Pedersen -> Remove Scheduled Event by joe -> Re: detecting power outage by Guy K Hillyer -> Dims and the single LynX by michael@shed.com -> on this day by michael@shed.com -> Just a Test by michael@shed.com ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Date: 17 Jul 1998 02:21:23 -0700 From: Chuck Shotton Subject: Re: Telephone off-hook detector and wireless speakers >I'm playing around with wireless speakers, using appliance modules to control >what rooms get the sound. My main beef is the click the appliance module makes >when turning on and off. Does the lamp module click like that too? Could I use >a lamp module on a speaker (15 volt AC adapter) without damaging the speaker >or the module? And speaking of noise, the speaker itself makes a pretty loud >click or thump when it is first turned on. Any way around that? How about >dimming the speaker gradually from 0 to 100? Or would that fry it? I fried quite a few A/C adapters before it dawned on me that using them with lamp modules is a horribly bad idea. In their stock form, lamp modules draw a tiny bit of current and have circuitry to sense when the "lamp" is turned on manually, so they can power up instead of having to accept a remote X10 command to turn on. This is what ultimately kills the A/C adapters. The adapters sit there feeding on this tiny bit of current, trying to turn it into a usable voltage for the device they are powering and quickly cook themselves. The short answer is never use lamp modules for A/C adapters. The longer answer is a guess. But I'd guess if you performed the common modification of removing the local sense circuitry, you'd also eliminate the current trickle that fries A/C adapters and lamp modules would work fine. On your other subject of sensing off-hook telephones. If you really want to know when someone is on the phone, your PowerFlash hack sounds like a good one. If you're thinking of using that to signal XTension when someone is in a particular room, you should just drop the bucks for a Leviton phone transponder. It lets you use any touchtone phone as a X10 controller that can send all the X10 house and unit codes. It listens to the local phones as well as incoming calls. A cordless phone with speed dial becomes an awesome X10 remote. - --_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_- Chuck Shotton BIAP Systems, Inc. cshotton@biap.com http://www.biap.com/ "Shut up and eat your vegetables!!!" ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Date: 17 Jul 1998 02:51:00 -0700 From: petitg@llb.saclay.cea.fr (Petitgrand) Subject: Re: Telephone off-hook detector and wireless speakers Michael Herrick wrote on Thu, 16 Jul 1998 09:03:26 -0600: > I'm looking for a device that plugs into a phone line and sends an X10 ON command when I pick > the phone up and an OFF when I hang it up again. I've seen a thingy that plugs into a phone > line and turns on a red LED when the phone is off hook. I suppose this could be hacked to a > PowerFlash. Steve Fyfe wrote on Thu, 16 Jul 1998 12:49:05 -0400: > There were several suggestions made on this list > around March 2 and 3 of this year. Most were for cheap ways to hack your > own solution rather than off-the-shelf, but still worth a look. Could be that Steve reminds a discussion on the subject that we had on the neighbouring ADB_IO_Discussion@list. Here is the question and the simple solution I proposed which can be easily adapted to your case (see below). _________________________________________________________________________________________ >From ADB_IO_Discussion@lists.bzzzzzz.com Fri Dec 19 18:32 MET 1997 Return-Path: Subject: Monitor phone lines I have an ADBIO. I got it to play with, and it isn't doing anything right now. I have XTension, and I've recently set it up to give me some status info (via Mac speech) every hour. Problem is, when I'm on the phone, it's annoying. So, I thought the ADBIO would be a nice interface for this. I have three phone lines, and I should monitor all three. I don't need to log activity, just run a test once an hour, and if a line is in use, not speak. I can handle the scripting fine, but I'm not really an electronics person. I don't want to fry the ADBIO by just "trying it". I just hooked a cheap voltmeter to the line. Seems to be around 10v when inactive, and around 90v when active. Yikes. I didn't see a spike, just a fluctuation, when ringing. I'm embarrassed to say I wouldn't even know what kind of resistor (or other gizmo) to limit the voltage to whatever the ADBIO can deal with. So, any idea if this can be done, and what it would take to do it? Thanks, Mitch - --- Mitchell S. Cohen, Multimedia Systems Consulting Nothing is important... So, everything is important. mcohen@msystems.com, http://www.msystems.com _________________________________________________________________________________________ >From ADB_IO_Discussion@lists.bzzzzzz.com Sat Dec 20 09:10 MET 1997 Return-Path: From: "Sven U. Grenander" Subject: Re: Monitor phone lines Hi Mitch, Mitchell S. Cohen wrote: >I did run across a good possibility today. I was wandering through an >electronics shop looking for ideas. Something marvelously simple - an yes, any relay that would close at the desired voltage would seem to be what you need. If these folks have already done the work to set it up (to close a relay to turn on a tape deck) you ought to use their solution. Neat idea ! - -Sven _________________________________________________________________________________________ >From ADB_IO_Discussion@lists.bzzzzzz.com Sat Dec 20 17:54 MET 1997 Return-Path: From: petitg@llb.saclay.cea.fr (Petitgrand) Subject: Re: Monitor phone lines Hello Mitchell, > I have an ADBIO. > So, I thought the ADBIO would be a nice interface for this. I have three > phone lines, and I should monitor all three. I don't need to log > activity, just run a test once an hour, and if a line is in use, not > speak. As Sven alrady pointed out what you need is just something like a relay. However it's probably not very easy (and could be expensive) to get a 90 V relay. Furthermore you must be sure that the relay will open when the line voltage drops to 10 V. I think a Vz = 12 - 15 V Zener diode is needed. In fact you can do exactly the same in a more flexible way with only 4 electronic components: 2 resistors, 1 Zener diode, 1 Optoisolator It will be even cheaper: not more than $5 - $10 > but at over $100 apiece, that's $300+ to monitor the three lines. > I'm hoping to do the whole thing for around $40 The opto-isolator is just to obtain a full isolation from the 90 V (it gives a 2500 V Electrical isolation). In principle such a device can be put inside the ADB I/O (Port A). However this would mean that the line between the phone and the ADB I/O will still be at 90 V. > I don't want to fry the ADBIO by just "trying it". If you don't fry the ADB I/O you could fry your fingers! :-0 I think it's better to put all components including the opto-isolator within the phone socket box, or in a box near. Thus the line will be at no more than 5 Volts and completely isolated from the phone line. Resistors have values to get about 2 mA in the opto-isolator.It's better (safer) to put 2 instead of 1 resistance for such a high voltage. Though power is not a problem, middle size resistances are preferable, again because of the voltage. The Zener diode ensures that no current will flow in the opto-isolator for voltages below Vz. It must be connected in the right way: you must measure Vz when the line is at 90 V. If you measure a very small voltage (1-2 V) it is in the wrong sense. The Input and the Output of the opto-isolator are also polarised.(pin numbers are given for the TIL 197 of Texas Instrument). You must measure not more than 1-2 V on the input of the opto-isolator. If you measure more it is in the wrong sense. The ouput of the opto-isolator can be connected to one of the Port B channel. This channel must be configured as "digital input" and the corresponding jumper must be set to "Pull-Up". Since the ouput of the opto-isolator is also polarised it must be connected as indicated on the drawing: Emitter (drawn as an arrow) to ground. If you have three independant lines, you will have to do that three times but you don't need to use three ADB I/O channels. You just put the three outputs of the opto-isolators in parallel, since they are working like closing contacts. Since I don't know wether an attached Graphic file is allowed on this List, I made a text drawing below: TO BE READABLE, THE DRAWING MUST BE LOOKED AT WITH A WINDOW WIDE ENOUGH (THIS LINE UNWRAPPED) ____________________________________ ______________________ I I I I I I ________________________ I I I + phone line I I I I I I I I I=I I I I I=I R I I I I=I I I I I I I I I I I I I=I I I I I=I R I I I I=I I I I I I I I I I I ADB I/O I IZI Zener I I I IZI I I I I I I I I I I I +---1----------+ I I I I 4------ I-------------------------- I 1 I I Opto-isol I I I Port B I I -> 3-------I-------------------------- I Gnd Pull-Up I +---2----------+ I I I I I I I I I I I I I I I _________________I________ I I I - phone line I I I ____________________________________I I_____________________I Phone socket R = 22 kOhms Z = Zener diode 12-15 V Opto-isolator = TIL 197 (Texas Instrument) or equivalent Good luck, Daniel Petitgrand _________________________________________________________________________________________ > I suppose this could be hacked to a PowerFlash. The simplest solution is to connect the PowerFlash in place of the optoisolator. use input A of the PowerFlash and connect the right polarities. Make sure that the current limited by the 2 resistors is enough (who knows that current?) to drive the powerFlash. R can be changed down to 2 x 4.7 kOhms (1 Watt) if necessary. Daniel Petitgrand ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Date: 17 Jul 1998 05:44:51 -0700 From: michael@shed.com Subject: AC adaptors and Dimmers Chuck Shotton wrote: > The short answer is never use lamp modules for A/C adapters. Hi Folks, After reading this thread, I realize that there is something missing in the description of the 'A/C adaptor'.... There are AC to AC adaptors, and AC to DC ones... The AC to AC adaptors are simply 'transformers', and theoretically should be 'dimmable' just by reducing the input voltage. BUT the AC to DC models are tiny 'power supplies' which are designed to expect a certain input level (AC), and they don't like to run with less than 'line voltage' input. The Wireless Speakers can be powered by an adaptor, but the adaptor must output 6 volts DC, not AC. So, you must not try to use a common X-10 Lamp dimmer with them. I recently bought a 5-light set of 20W halogen 'under counter' lights. These are powered by a 'A/C adaptor' or 'wall wart'.. I wasn't expecting it, but written on the package was the declaration: "DIMMABLE" !!! When I examined the wall wart, it was marked with a burned-in label which also said 'dimmable'. Well, I couldn't resist, so I now have these lights mounted in a sort of 'pool table' light fixture over my desk. After about three weeks, I've not noticed any overheating of the wall wart, and it does DIM/BRI properly, AS LONG AS I don't turn it OFF ! You'll remember that we have discussed this little foible. If you don't have a 'sufficient' LOAD on a dimmer module, you can do everything with the lamp except turn it ON from OFF. It will brighten up from zero, and down to zero, but if you turn it OFF, you cannot remotely turn it ON again. Now I can make sure that I never send an OFF to the unit, but if we have a powerfailure, I find that I have to manually reset the Dimmer. This is not completely satisfying, but it hasn't been enough of a problem to make me change it out. michael ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Date: 17 Jul 1998 06:42:18 -0700 From: Phil Pedersen Subject: Re: AC adaptors and Dimmers Michael wrote: >Hi Folks, > >After reading this thread, I realize that there is something missing >in the description of the 'A/C adaptor'.... > >There are AC to AC adaptors, and AC to DC ones... After reading these messages, there may be something else that people don't realize. I don't remember a discussion anywhere other than maybe some of the technical X10 descriptions about what the dimming module does. It doesn't reduce the amplitude of the 60 Hz AC waveform, i.e., from 120VAC (which is a sinusoidal voltage with a peak amplitude of about 170V) to the same sinusoidal waveform with a lower peak. The triac in the dimming module chops out some of the AC waveform so that the RMS (root mean square) voltage is reduced, but the absolute amplitudes of what the triac lets through are the same as always. The resultant waveform getting to the load is only piece-wise sinusoidal, with some very large, very fast changes in amplitude. Note that all replacement dimmers for light switches work this way too. This plays hell with anything that expects a nice smooth (relatively) AC waveform. That's why dimmer modules don't work for most fans, which need a smooth transition from zero to peak and back down so that the magnetic fields in the motor expand and collapse nicely and don't cause the windings to move suddenly, causing the annoying hum. :^) AC to DC adapters try to take this strange waveform and convert it to the DC voltage they're supposed to. If the DC output is a simple diode rectifier with a capacitor filter and no regulated output, like the halogen lights that Michael has, then the DC voltage more or less follows the AC voltage up and down. I've had some halogen l;amps where the transformers have lasted for a while, but have finally burned out due to the additional heating caused by the non-sinusoidal AC input caused by the dimming module. The adaptors have to be made to take the dimming. If the DC output voltage is regulated, then the regulator has to work much harder with the lower input voltage to get the designed output voltage and can burn out pretty quickly. Phil ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Date: 17 Jul 1998 06:44:29 -0700 From: Andy Montag Subject: Re: Telephone off-hook detector and wireless speakers You absolutely cannot plug your speakers ac adaptor into a lamp module. I melted one of my speakers power supplies foolishly trying this very thing. I'm guessing trying to dim the speakers power would have the same result. As for that annoying turn-on thump, I solved that by always leaving the speakers on and just sending them a signal when an announcement needs to be made. To do that I put a universal module in line with the audio signal coming out of the mac, giving me a way to silently "turn on and off" the speakers. While this doesn't allow for seperate turn ons for the various speakers in various rooms, it does keep every system beep and button push from being broadcast throuhgout the house. It also allows me to globally block announcements from a keychain remote when going to bed. Andy >From: lists@matterform.com (Michael Herrick) >Subject: Telephone off-hook detector and wireless speakers > >I'm playing around with wireless speakers, using appliance modules to control >what rooms get the sound. My main beef is the click the appliance module makes >when turning on and off. Does the lamp module click like that too? Could I use >a lamp module on a speaker (15 volt AC adapter) without damaging the speaker >or the module? And speaking of noise, the speaker itself makes a pretty loud >click or thump when it is first turned on. Any way around that? How about >dimming the speaker gradually from 0 to 100? Or would that fry it? > >- --Michael ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Date: 17 Jul 1998 06:45:14 -0700 From: Phil Pedersen Subject: new Xtension? I happened to look over at http://www.shed.com yesterday and saw that there was a version 2.0 out. I didn't see it mentioned anywhere on the list. Am I losing messages somewhere? Phil ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Date: 17 Jul 1998 06:55:19 -0700 From: Guy K Hillyer Subject: dim not triggering script Using XTension 1.7.5.5, I've created a unit with address H2, made it dimmable, and put this command in its "on" script: write log (future value) When I issue "H2 on" from a remote, the script logs the value 100, and when I issue "H2 off", the script logs 0 -- as expected. However, the script is apparently never triggered by "H2 dim". Is this normal? ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Date: 17 Jul 1998 07:09:17 -0700 From: Wedge@mindless.com Subject: Connecting Macs Well, made the big jump - just bought a Mac IIsi for $40 thanks to the Coleman's tip they put on the list. Now I have to figure out what the best (reliable but cheap) way to connect two Macs is. I want to leave the IIsi as the always-running mac and access it with my PPC mac when I turn it on. Since serial ports will be at a premium and the PPC has built in Ethernet, I am looking (until someone gives me a better idea...) at ethernet cards for the IIsi. Any hints? Things NOT to do? Also, I will eventually need 4 serial ports for all the various crazy plans I have. What is the best method of expanding the ports? I have seen a few suggestions, but no direct discussion comparing various methods. (Is this something I should search the archives for first, before posting questions?) Any help would be greatly appreciated.... Semper Fi, James ps, Michael - I am starting to gain some sympathy for you. It is supposed to hit over 100 degrees today. Normally not a big deal, but I am in MONTANA for crying out loud - it is supposed to be nice and cool up here! - -- __ _ww _a+"D y#, _r^ # _*^ y` q0 0 a" W*` F ____ ; #^ Mw` __`. . 4-~~^^` _ _P ` /'^ `www=. , $ +F ` q K ] ^K` , #_ . ___ r ], _*.^ '.__dP^^~#, ,_ *, ^b / _ `` _F ] ]_ '___ ' ~~^ ] [ :` ]b_ ~k_ ,` yl #P `*a__ __a~ z~` #L _ ^------~^` ,/ ~-vww*"v_ _/` ^"q_ _x" __#my..___p/`mma____ _awP",`,^"-_"^`._ L L # _#0w_^_^,^r___...._ t [],"w ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Date: 17 Jul 1998 07:12:39 -0700 From: Guy K Hillyer Subject: detecting power outage I have XTension running on an ancient powerbook so it doesn't notice when there is a power failure. Is there some easy way to send an X-10 command when the power comes back on, so that XTension can know that it happened and take some action? ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Date: 17 Jul 1998 07:14:11 -0700 From: michael@shed.com Subject: Re: dim not triggering script Hello Guy, I just tested this, and it does work. I assume that you are commanding the unit by its NAME and not its Address ? By address, the script will not run. michael ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Date: 17 Jul 1998 07:18:32 -0700 From: michael@shed.com Subject: Re: AC adaptors and Dimmers Hi Folks, The A/C adaptor that I have on the halogen lights is an AC to AC adaptor, not a AC to DC... But it has been installed for only about 3 weeks. The longevity of this setup is still uncertain ... michael ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Date: 17 Jul 1998 07:20:54 -0700 From: michael@shed.com Subject: Re: Telephone off-hook detector and wireless speakers Andy Montag wrote: > > I put a universal module in line with the audio signal > coming out of the mac, giving me a way to silently "turn on and off" the > speakers. While this doesn't allow for seperate turn ons for the various > speakers in various rooms, it does keep every system beep and button push > from being broadcast throuhgout the house. It also allows me to globally > block announcements from a keychain remote when going to bed. Very nice solution ! michael ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Date: 17 Jul 1998 07:23:01 -0700 From: Guy K Hillyer Subject: Re: dim not triggering script michael@shed.com writes: > Hello Guy, > > I just tested this, and it does work. > > I assume that you are commanding the unit by its NAME > and not its Address ? By address, the script will not run. > > michael > > Oh -- I was issuing the DIM command from an X-10 remote. So this is not supposed to work? ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Date: 17 Jul 1998 07:25:16 -0700 From: michael@shed.com Subject: Re: new Xtension? Hi Phil, I just wondered how long it would take ... :-) Actually, I was a bit timid about releasing this version because there are still many things that are to be done. but... "There comes a time in the life of every product, when it's time to shoot the engineer and build the product..." I am at this time building version 2.0.1 .... Guess what? It has a 'sizable script editor window' ! You're not losing messages, I'm just getting lazy... michael ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Date: 17 Jul 1998 07:36:06 -0700 From: michael@shed.com Subject: Re: dim not triggering script Guy K Hillyer wrote: > Oh -- I was issuing the DIM command from an X-10 remote. So this is > not supposed to work? Hello Guy, Well, You got me on this one. There is a problem with the CM11 version .... For some reason, even though I can easily track DIMs sent from another controller (LynX/CM11), there is a problem tracking DIMs from one of the Mini-Controllers. I don't have a good handle on just what this is yet, but yes, it is broke, and I am working on it. So far I've been able to capture the data coming in from the CM11, but it looks identical to that coming from the mini-controller. in work michael ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Date: 17 Jul 1998 08:10:50 -0700 From: michael@shed.com Subject: Re: detecting power outage Hello Guy, > I have XTension running on an ancient powerbook so it doesn't notice > when there is a power failure. Is there some easy way to send an X-10 > command when the power comes back on, so that XTension can know that > it happened and take some action? This is a conundrum. Since the CM11 is powered from the mains, when the power goes, so goes the CM11. AND, it doesn't send any kind of warning or notice, when it goes down or comes back up... On the other hand, the LynX, can be powered by a UPS, and it will announce when the TW523 has lost signal. This doesn't mean that it's impossible to detect this... But I bet that there are others here who have thought about it and can offer better suggestions than I. A few versions back, I added a couple of things which could help, but whenever I think about this, I get a headache. The problem is that you don't want to create a solution which is more bothersome than the problem. IE: you don't want to be 'pinging' the line all the time to see if the CM11 is still there. And, since most powerfails are of short duration (more of them), you would have to be testing pretty often, and that would create too much overhead. XTension will of course announce that it has lost contact, within 5 minutes of the failure, if the power is still off. One thing that would be nice would be if your UPS gave you a signal that said that the power failed. Another thing, if you're using a Laptop as the host. Does the MacOS offer any way of triggering an applet if it detects that the power has failed and we're running on battery? good fodder michael ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Date: 17 Jul 1998 08:49:28 -0700 From: Steve Fyfe Subject: Re: detecting power outage Guy K Hillyer said on 7/17/98 10:12 AM >I have XTension running on an ancient powerbook so it doesn't notice >when there is a power failure. Is there some easy way to send an X-10 >command when the power comes back on, so that XTension can know that >it happened and take some action? Get a low voltage wall wart and hook the output to a Powerflash unit. Set the Powerflash to send an x10 when it senses the voltage. _____________________________________________________________ Steve Fyfe Windward Services Group (978) 386-7260 PO Box 340 (978) 386-7322 Fax Ashby, Massachusetts 01431-0340 Information Technology that Works for Your Business ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Date: 17 Jul 1998 11:47:43 -0700 From: Phil Pedersen Subject: Re: new Xtension? Hi Michael, OK, I didn't think I missed any, but I wasn't sure. I installed it last night and after some minor weirdness, it seems to be working OK. I suspect throwing away the preferences file may be a good thing. I *did* notice that the scheduled events window was missing a horizontal scroll bar. I think it used to have one. Going from 1.XX to 2.XX usually means substantial upgrades that we might be expected to pay an upgrade fee for (unless it's windows where you pay all the time; both in cash and annoyance :^)). Have you thought about rolling things into a Pro version or some such so you could get a little bit larger revenue stream? Phil >Hi Phil, > >I just wondered how long it would take ... :-) > >Actually, I was a bit timid about releasing this version >because there are still many things that are to be done. > >but... > >"There comes a time in the life of every product, when it's > time to shoot the engineer and build the product..." > >I am at this time building version 2.0.1 .... > >Guess what? It has a 'sizable script editor window' ! > >You're not losing messages, I'm just getting lazy... >michael ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Date: 17 Jul 1998 11:55:46 -0700 From: joe Subject: Remove Scheduled Event Hi Michael, I think I may have found an error in the XTension manual. I am trying out some stuff written in the manual regarding removing created events. I copied the example shown in the manual to do the following: When I issue this command after creating several events called "Master BR Table Lamp": remove unit events for "Master BR Table Lamp" I get the following error: A " can't go after this identifier. But it works OK when I remove the word "for" such as: remove unit events "Master BR Table Lamp" I know this is a small thing but I got really mixed up when trying to learn how to do this. Perhaps you might correct it in the manual for the future when you get a moment. Is it possible that it IS correct in the manual and this problem is only peculiar to my set up? Joe Sonne ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ joe@gbgraphics.com http://www.gbgraphics.com ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Date: 17 Jul 1998 12:21:23 -0700 From: Guy K Hillyer Subject: Re: detecting power outage Steve Fyfe writes: > Get a low voltage wall wart and hook the output to a Powerflash unit. Set > the Powerflash to send an x10 when it senses the voltage. Just the sort of idea I was looking for. I wonder if the CM11 would finish its power-up tasks soon enough to receive the command? ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Date: 17 Jul 1998 12:22:07 -0700 From: michael@shed.com Subject: Dims and the single LynX Hi Folks, Note: this is a long and technical note. Summary: Manual DIM/BRI commands from a mini/maxi controller or a wireless one, are NOT reliable in a system where you have autonomous devices (sensors). This has nothing to do with XTension or your X-10 interface. The most Reliable method of controlling the level of your lamps is to never use direct DIM/BRI commands from manual controllers. Rather, use only indirect commands to XTension... IE: a 'pseudo unit' with ON and OFF scripts that correspond to Brighten and Dim of a real Lamp or group of lamps. - ------- ON script for "Control the Lamp" : if (value of "the lamp" < 91) then brighten "the lamp" to (value of "the lamp") + 10 else turn on "the Lamp" end if - ------------- OFF script for "Control the Lamp" : if (value of "the lamp" > 10) then dim "the lamp" to (value of "the lamp") - 10 else dim "the lamp" to 0 end if - ------------------------- End of simple summary....... michael I was afraid of this. I've just done some tests of the DIM/BRI commands as sent from the MiniController and the wireless RT504/RR501 set. Now you'd think that I would have done this already, but never before have I tried to do a comparison of the different X-10 transmitters, and the raw data that is actually sent to XTension from the interface, and the real effect that the commands have on a dimmable module... WOW! You would not believe the stuff that happens. There are so many different cases! Consistent results are so 'delicate' that I'm quite dismayed. If you recall, each X-10 command consists of two parts, the Address and the Function. These two elements are sent separately in time. The common X-10 receivers have logic that can remember whether it has been 'addressed', and when a 'function' is received, whether to respond or not. Thus, theoretically, you can send an address 'A4', and wait 1 hour and then send AON, and A4 will turn on... That is, in a perfekt world ? Within the world of normal X-10 devices, (ie: no computer or CM11), you would think that you can simply pick up a remote controller and hit the right button and make a lamp dim or brighten. Well, it don't work that way and as a matter of fact, I'm beginning to think that the only reliable way to dim/bri a lamp is via XTension and an interface, using only ON and OFF commands to indirectly control a dimmable unit/group ! I have both the Mini and Maxi controllers, as well as both types of wireless transceiver, and every type of wireless control, including the new TV/VCR models. In the past 4 hours, I have been able to create the most ridiculous nonsense of behavior from these simple devices. Without XTension or any interface sending anything... Yes, I can create an isolated system wherein there are no X-10 transmitters other than one, and I can see that in such a simple environment, it is possible to control your lights (dim/bri), without a problem. However, if you have motion sensors etc that can send signals autonomously, I find that things get screwed up very quickly. For example: I issue a manual command (mini-controller) to turn on A4. Then I press the DIM button. If I hold down the button, I see the lamp (A4) indeed dim. Then I release, and (it's not dim enough) push DIM again. Nothing happens.... I look in the Log Window of XTension (monitoring), and see that in that the Water Pump came on during this time and sent an ON command for a different housecode. Ok, I start trying different cases, and I find that it is so delicate a thing to get the Lamp module to respond to the manual commands that I'm amazed that the X-10 system has survived ! Part of the problem is that the manual controllers will not 're-address' a unit if you simply press a DIM/BRI button. They simply send out a "HOUSECODE/DIM" function code without sending the UNIT address again. They assume that any unit addresses have already been sent. (Normal use of the manual controllers requires that you indeed send an ON or OFF to a unit before you send DIM or BRI commands. But you may elect to press ON for more than one address in the same housecode, before you press the DIM...) Part of the problem is that the receivers will 'reset' their 'I'm addressed' flags whenever they see a X-10 command for a unit that is on another housecode. Without the autonomous events occuring, what kind of system do you have ? And, with all this variety, how can XTension possibly 'track' what is really happening to the dimmable units when you issue manual dim/bri's...? And to a lesser degree, ON/OFF's... This is not as simple a thing as I have described. I have a lot of captures of the raw data from three different 'receivers', as well as the behavior of the Lamp module. The 'captures' of the raw data are not done using XTension, but rather a simple applet which simply writes the data from the interface to a data file. In this way, I've been able to capture the data from the LynX, the CM11, and the 'twoway'. The LynX and the 'tw' are even more restricted in that they have to talk to the powerlines thru the TW523. The TW523 cannot 'track' DIM/BRI sequences, and thus will report only one or two dims out of three. Worse yet, I have found that the CM11 often reports falacious commands when it receives DIMs.....! I very carefully sent DIMs for A4, and very clearly in the raw data, the CM11 interspersed the A4 dims with those of a housecode "M"... I have pasted below an example 'capture', with interpretation. If you understand the CM11 protocol, you can see that I haven't been whistling 'Dixie' in the past when I have complained about the complexity of the CM11 protocol... I suggest that if there are any of you who have read to this point and are interested in helping me decide just how we should treat such things, that we should do it privately until we can get some consensus. michael - ------------------------------------------------- Lines are 'paired' First is the 'raw' data from the CM11 first byte is the count of chars following second is a 'mask' 1 = function, 0 = address/data position in mask is reverse of order of byte. Next is a terse interpretation of the meaning... 05 0A D1 D2 0A 03 H5 HON M4 MOFF 03 01 14 0D EDIM 13 03 01 14 03 EDIM 3 03 01 04 02 MDIM 02 03 01 14 03 EDIM 03 03 01 04 02 MDIM 02 03 01 14 03 EDIM 03 03 01 04 7B MDIM 123 03 01 14 03 EDIM 03 09 55 04 02 14 03 04 02 14 0D MDIM 02 EDIM 03 MDIM 02 EDIM 0D 03 01 14 0D EDIM 0D 02 00 1C E16 02 01 13 EOFF 03 01 14 03 EDIM 03 07 15 04 02 14 0D 14 03 MDIM 02 EDIM 0D EDIM 03 03 01 04 02 MDIM 02 09 55 14 03 04 02 14 03 04 02 EDIM 03 MDIM 02 EDIM 03 MDIM 02 03 01 14 03 EDIM 03 07 15 04 02 14 03 04 02 MDIM 02 EDIM 03 MDIM 02 ..... ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Date: 17 Jul 1998 14:37:01 -0700 From: michael@shed.com Subject: on this day Hi Folks, Being both my birthday and that of XTension, I'm moved to comment on the "state of the home automation industry".... It's been two years now, and lots of new friends. But it's still a very poor market for home automation, and although we see new companies popping up, it's not growing at a rate that would be 'reasonable' given the infrastructure that exists. My personal approach to marketing is that I choose a market that has lots of pieces and parts, and make something that makes them go together better. Thus I can sort of 'tail-gate' their marketing. But lately, I've been so discouraged by the kind of attention that home automation has been getting. Although there have been earlier TV articles on the "Butler in a Box" system, which were equally bad, the most recent one was even more depressing because of all of the commentary from the participants to the effect that 'this just doesn't work'... Who's going to spend their time, dedicate a computer, and hundreds of dollars just to have the lights dim as you enter a room, or the lights come on as your visitors drive in....? For less than $50 you can do that... Some companies have tried to crack the HA nut with millions of bucks poured into advertising and glitz. For example the HAL2000. I really have great hopes for this product because they are spending a lot of bucks and really trying to make it simple with voice commands etc. But I have heard recently that at least one distributor of HAL2000 automatically sends a RMA form with each unit... It's not their fault, it's just that our expectations of such a system are far greater than the technology can give us at this time, for a price that is reasonable. We can easily utter commands in a clean environment to 'turn on the lights', but there are so many things that can cause problems when you try to do complex things like tell the home to remember to record Rosie O'Grady on Thursday at 4PM. For overy 30 years, we've been accustomed to Captain Kirk simply chatting with the ship's computer, and lately we've seen a holo-image of how one might appear. ( Couldn't you guess he'd be obnoxious ? :-) We can comprehend it, and we'd really like to have it, but we just ain't there yet. To some degree, we can enjoy some of the things that we can do with the Mac's speech recognition and voice output, but it will be another 10 to 20 years before this stuff is anything more than a 'dancing bear' when it comes to voice commands. Perhaps a little longer before we can chat with a 'holo-image'. Another element: There have been some beautiful homes written up in PHA, and Electronic House, and HomePro etc, but often the point of interest is the infrastructure and not what really happens day to day. Most often the center of interest is the control of lighting, and draperies and sprinkler systems. But always the most salient item is the setting of lights to some 'scene'... Now, I have many lights which are controlled, without some of which I would kill myself at night anymore, and I love the fact that my bathroom light doesn't give me a heart attack at night. But if that were all there were to my system, I would hardly be as enthusiastic as I am. Without the sensors all about that monitor the water pump, and the air conditioners and movement in all areas, this system would be just a toy. Without the fact that it tells me via voice messages that there is something to pay attention to, I would not be so attached to it. My system really seems like just another member of the household. It's a real thing that I anticipate and 'thank' for its services. It truly has taken on a life of its own. There are homes out there which would not qualify for pages in Better Homes & Gardens, and mine would be better fit in Coevolution Quarterly. But I hear daily from folks who have HA systems that would make Bill Gates take notice! I really believe that this thing will take off someday, and that we'll all chuckle at these awkward times... michael ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Date: 17 Jul 1998 20:36:59 -0700 From: michael@shed.com Subject: Just a Test Just a test, I think the list server is down ??? michael ---------------------------------------------------------------------- End of Digest To request a copy of the help file, reply to this message and put "help" in the subject. Subject: Digest for 7/18/98 Date: Sat, 18 Jul 1998 22:44:34 -0700 From: "XTension Discussion" To: "XTension Discussion" -> Claris Emailer Script by Steve Zimmerman -> List Problems by michael@shed.com -> Re: detecting power outage by michael@shed.com -> Re: new Xtension? by michael@shed.com -> Re: detecting power outage by Keelan Lightfoot -> Re: new Xtension? by Greg Satz -> Re: new Xtension? by michael@shed.com -> Re: detecting power outage by michael@shed.com -> Re: Claris Emailer Script by mitchc -> Re: Remove Scheduled Event by Jim Schram -> Re: Claris Emailer Script by michael@shed.com -> Re: Remove Scheduled Event by michael@shed.com -> Talking Classic II by "Andre_Campeau" -> Re: detecting power outage by Steve Fyfe -> Re: detecting power outage by michael@shed.com -> Re: Talking Classic II by Steve Fyfe -> Re: detecting power outage by Steve Fyfe -> Re: Talking Classic II by "Andre_Campeau" ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Date: 18 Jul 1998 09:15:06 -0700 From: Steve Zimmerman Subject: Claris Emailer Script I would like to use Xtension to send a copy of the log to my email address at work if something needs attention. I have two questions that I am having trouble resolving: 1. Is there a way to save a copy of the XTension log to a file? 2. I've written a script for Claris Emailer that will send a message, but I haven't had any luck attaching a file. Can anyone give me some guidance? This is the script I am using to create the message: tell application "Claris Emailer" activate set bodyvar to "Test body." set addrVar to "szimmer@alleghenypower.com" set addrNameVar to "Steve Zimmerman" set subjectvar to "Test Subject " make new outgoing message with properties #194# {subject:subjectvar, content:bodyvar, scheduled:true, recipient:{{address:{address:addrVar, display name:addrNameVar}, recipient type:to recipient, delivery status:unsent}}} end tell thanks, Steve Zimmerman szimmer@nfis.com ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Date: 18 Jul 1998 09:33:29 -0700 From: michael@shed.com Subject: List Problems Hi Folks, For whatever reason, the XTension Discussion list server has been down for the past 24 hours, and it appears that it is now back... Thanks to the person who hit the button ... michael ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Date: 18 Jul 1998 09:43:31 -0700 From: michael@shed.com Subject: Re: detecting power outage Guy K Hillyer wrote: > > Steve Fyfe writes: > > Get a low voltage wall wart and hook the output to a Powerflash unit. Set > > the Powerflash to send an x10 when it senses the voltage. > > Just the sort of idea I was looking for. I wonder if the CM11 would > finish its power-up tasks soon enough to receive the command? Hi Guy, The PowerFlash has to do a startup too, but it may be a 'race'. It might be possible to put a capacitor in the line from the wall wart, and delay the voltage a bit ? Should be easy to test .... anyone ? michael ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Date: 18 Jul 1998 10:02:13 -0700 From: michael@shed.com Subject: Re: new Xtension? Phil Pedersen wrote: > I installed (2.0) last night and after some minor weirdness, it seems to be > working OK. I suspect throwing away the preferences file may be a good > thing. This is something that should be done when upgrading XTension at any time. I am remiss in not making this more obvious. The Prefs is the one file that does change often, the more we add features. > I *did* notice that the scheduled events window was missing a horizontal > scroll bar. I think it used to have one. (Hushhhhhh.... it never did.) rest of message and response in the next thread... michael ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Date: 18 Jul 1998 10:06:42 -0700 From: Keelan Lightfoot Subject: Re: detecting power outage >I have XTension running on an ancient powerbook so it doesn't notice >when there is a power failure. Is there some easy way to send an X-10 >command when the power comes back on, so that XTension can know that >it happened and take some action? How about using an ADB I/O to check for power line voltage? You could connect a cheap 5v DC adapter to the ADB I/O, so that it would detect power failure when the +5v disappears, or you could connect a 120v relay the power lines, so that the ADB I/O would detect a power failure indicated by the relay's contacts opening. to the You could have a small applescript poll the ADB I/O, and take action in the event of power failure. Seeing as it is powered by the computer, you could always check for power. Not a cheap solution, but an easy one... - - Keelan Lightfoot (Hoping to get into X-10 stuff soon) ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Date: 18 Jul 1998 10:17:42 -0700 From: Greg Satz Subject: Re: new Xtension? Why not add a version number to the preferences file? Then when the version number changes, XTension can delete the old preferences file itself and save the user some headache. Or better yet it can parse the old preferences and write a new style format. Thanks, Greg At 1:02 PM -0400 7/18/98, michael@shed.com wrote: >Phil Pedersen wrote: > >> I installed (2.0) last night and after some minor weirdness, it seems to be >> working OK. I suspect throwing away the preferences file may be a good >> thing. > >This is something that should be done when upgrading XTension at any >time. >I am remiss in not making this more obvious. The Prefs is the one file >that does change often, the more we add features. > >> I *did* notice that the scheduled events window was missing a horizontal >> scroll bar. I think it used to have one. > >(Hushhhhhh.... it never did.) > >rest of message and response in the next thread... > >michael ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Date: 18 Jul 1998 10:26:43 -0700 From: michael@shed.com Subject: Re: new Xtension? Phil Pedersen wrote: > Going from 1.XX to 2.XX usually means substantial upgrades that we might be > expected to pay an upgrade fee for (unless it's windows where you pay all > the time; both in cash and annoyance :^)). Have you thought about rolling > things into a Pro version or some such so you could get a little bit larger > revenue stream? Hi Phil, I haven't really thought seriously about a Pro version for more than a year now... Many of the things that have been added recently for external app interface, are things that would be in such a version. It is getting more and more evident that XTension is nearing a point that a decision has to be made. Whether to continue to develop XTension as a single application, or to start breaking out into special 'agent' type application interfaces which call on XTension, but provide custom 'talking heads' and heirarchical PlainTalk voice interface. The primary mission of XTension has always been to be continuously reliable to a degree that very few other applications are asked to be. It has also been my personal 'thing' that XTension continue to be able to run on any old Mac with only 4MB of RAM. If XTension is to continue into the OS X world, then there will have to be two different physical versions of XTension, one for each world. At some point, there will be features in the OS X world that will not be available in the old world. So we have a 'division' coming up which can't be avoided. Thus there is going to be the bother of maintaining two different apps, and inventory, support etc. If I am to develop a PRO version, then it follows that there would have to be a version for both the new and old world. So now I got 4 different versions, and four different interfaces, etc. Ok, so maybe the PRO version provides the ability to choose the interface rather than being interface dependent. We still got 10 different products in inventory. Contrast this with the idea of just two versions of XTension, each with the ability to choose the interface, providing verbs and attachments which expect that there will be another application which really does all the neat 3DVR and speech recognition goodies... It could be that many different third party 'agents' could be developed by list members which would either be shareware or freeware, or maybe even become 'the' app that you think of when you think of Mac home automation. The logic of separating the functions means that likely you can continue to have the XTension 'host' on the old Closet Mac, and do the agent thing on your newest iMac or G5.... But regardless of what crashes on the G5, the little old Mac in the closet just keeps going.... enuf, any comments ? michael ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Date: 18 Jul 1998 10:40:22 -0700 From: michael@shed.com Subject: Re: detecting power outage Keelan Lightfoot wrote: > How about using an ADB I/O to check for power line voltage?> > (Hoping to get into X-10 stuff soon) Hello Keelan, (I noticed you signed on recently. I don't think that many others on the list know that Keelan is a long-time regular contributor to other Beehive lists, and an avid ADB I/O experimentor.) I put a simple 'solar cell' across one of the analog inputs to the ADB I/O, and taped it to a light bulb which I controlled with a X-10 Lamp module. I did this in order to play with the 'feedback' between the X-10 system and the ADB I/O, but I found that it was also a good way to detect that the power had failed or that the Lamp Module was out of 'sync' with XTension. The benefit was twofold... feedback that the lamp is on and an idea of its level, as well as a powerfail detector. Of course, the Lamp module won't come back on when the power does (X-10 versions), but since you do know that the power is off, you could periodically try to turn on the Lamp, and when you saw the feedback from the solar cell and the ADB I/O, then you'd know .... welcome to the list, we need more input from the ADB I/O arena... michael ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Date: 18 Jul 1998 10:41:15 -0700 From: mitchc Subject: Re: Claris Emailer Script > activate > set bodyvar to "Test body." > set addrVar to "szimmer@alleghenypower.com" > set addrNameVar to "Steve Zimmerman" > set subjectvar to "Test Subject " set filesvar to {"Macintosh HD:XTension 1.7:XTension log"} (Obviously replacing this with the path to the file.) make new outgoing message with properties #194# {subject:subjectvar, file:filesvar, content:bodyvar, scheduled:true, recipient:{{address:{address:addrVar, display name:addrNameVar}, recipient type:to recipient, delivery status:unsent}}} I haven't tried this with the XTension log; I don't know if there would be an issue since the log would be open. (I just did a quick test and it seemed fine.) The logfile is text, so saving it as something else wouldn't be necessary. You may also want to add "compress enclosures:true" if the logfile is large. ...Mitch - --- Mitchell S. Cohen, Multimedia Systems Consulting Nothing is important... So, everything is important. mcohen@msystems.com, http://www.msystems.com ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Date: 18 Jul 1998 12:04:50 -0700 From: Jim Schram Subject: Re: Remove Scheduled Event Hi Joe, >remove unit events for "Master BR Table Lamp" > >I get the following error: > >A " can't go after this identifier. > >But it works OK when I remove the word "for" such as: > >remove unit events "Master BR Table Lamp" > >I know this is a small thing but I got really mixed up when trying to >learn how to do this. Perhaps you might correct it in the manual for the >future when you get a moment. Is it possible that it IS correct in the >manual and this problem is only peculiar to my set up? I got the same error message in all the flavors of XTension I've used, so I guess the documentation has a bug. DOAH! :oP - -- Jim ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Date: 18 Jul 1998 12:11:40 -0700 From: michael@shed.com Subject: Re: Claris Emailer Script Hi Folks, Do you have any idea how aggravating and frustrating it can be to get good 'poop' from a discussion list ? Is it my imagination or has this list 'sprouted wings' in the past two weeks ? It may be that Mitch's response has to be modified locally, but it's really gratifying that folks will take the time to help others with such things. :-) michael mitchc wrote: > > > activate > > set bodyvar to "Test body." > > set addrVar to "szimmer@alleghenypower.com" > > set addrNameVar to "Steve Zimmerman" > > set subjectvar to "Test Subject " > > set filesvar to {"Macintosh HD:XTension 1.7:XTension log"} > > (Obviously replacing this with the path to the file.) > > make new outgoing message with properties #194# > {subject:subjectvar, file:filesvar, content:bodyvar, scheduled:true, recipient:{{address:{address:addrVar, display name:addrNameVar}, recipient > > I haven't tried this with the XTension log; I don't know if there would be an issue since the log would be open. (I just did a quick test and it seemed fine.) The logfile is text, so saving it as something else wouldn't be necessary. > > You may also want to add "compress enclosures:true" if the logfile is large. ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Date: 18 Jul 1998 12:26:33 -0700 From: michael@shed.com Subject: Re: Remove Scheduled Event Hello Joe, Yup, it's wrong. I'll make the change. thanks michael ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Date: 18 Jul 1998 12:36:07 -0700 From: "Andre_Campeau" Subject: Talking Classic II I'm trying to get XTension to talk on my Classic II but the speech is very choppy. Should I be getting a good enough speech off the Classic and if yes, what Extensions/Control Panels should I be using? I have MacinTalk 2 and 3, Sound Manager, Voices folder and Speech Control Panel. Would I be missing something? Thanks. Andre Campeau Ottawa, Canada campeau@ottawa.com ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Date: 18 Jul 1998 12:49:38 -0700 From: Steve Fyfe Subject: Re: detecting power outage Guy K Hillyer said on 7/17/98 3:21 PM >Steve Fyfe writes: > > Get a low voltage wall wart and hook the output to a Powerflash unit. Set > > the Powerflash to send an x10 when it senses the voltage. > >Just the sort of idea I was looking for. I wonder if the CM11 would >finish its power-up tasks soon enough to receive the command? The CM11 does have a built-in buffer where it will save x10 commands that come in until the software can ask for it. The CM11 also has a spot for a battery - I don't know exactly what is powered by the battery, but it might keep the CM11 going enough so it can respond right away when the power is restored. You might want to experiment a bit and see how well things work. HTH Steve _____________________________________________________________ Steve Fyfe Windward Services Group (978) 386-7260 PO Box 340 (978) 386-7322 Fax Ashby, Massachusetts 01431-0340 Information Technology that Works for Your Business ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Date: 18 Jul 1998 13:26:35 -0700 From: michael@shed.com Subject: Re: detecting power outage Steve Fyfe wrote: > The CM11 does have a built-in buffer where it will save x10 commands that > come in until the software can ask for it. It is a limited buffer, but I am often surprised that it does buffer at all... sometimes 4 or 5 commands. > The CM11 also has a spot for a battery - I don't know exactly what is > powered by the battery, but it might keep the CM11 going enough so it can > respond right away when the power is restored. Hmmmm. I have been suggesting since day one that the batteries in the CM11 were not necessary, and should be removed. Is it possible that with the newer CM11 ROM and the improved XTension, that it might be beneficial to have the batteries left in.... ?! In the case of a PowerFail, would it announce it to the Mac ? BUT, there is still the danger that the CM11 can get confused and try to create/initiate some macro or scheduled event by itself... Still, it's obvious that I've been arbitrarily ignoring this... michael ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Date: 18 Jul 1998 13:39:35 -0700 From: Steve Fyfe Subject: Re: Talking Classic II Andre Campeau said on 7/18/98 3:36 PM >I'm trying to get XTension to talk on my Classic II but the speech is >very choppy. [snip] > Would I be missing something? My guess is that you are missing a machine that is powerful enough to give smooth speech. ;-) I guess I'll find out, though. I will be moving XTension to a Classic II as soon as I get the machine - its on its way. _____________________________________________________________ Steve Fyfe Windward Services Group (978) 386-7260 PO Box 340 (978) 386-7322 Fax Ashby, Massachusetts 01431-0340 Information Technology that Works for Your Business ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Date: 18 Jul 1998 14:49:08 -0700 From: Steve Fyfe Subject: Re: detecting power outage Sand Hill Engineering said on 7/18/98 4:26 PM >I have been suggesting since day one that the batteries >in the CM11 were not necessary, and should be removed. I have wondered about this recommendation... Since the CM11 works without the batteries, I always assumed they were only there to make sure the CM11 would not lose it mind (ie its memory where the macros are stored) during a power failure. So taking the batteries out would not have any effect unless or until the power failed. But - after a powerfailure the memory could be garbage unless the batteries were there to keep it in good shape. Seems like no batteries is more risky than having them there. No?? Steve _____________________________________________________________ Steve Fyfe Windward Services Group (978) 386-7260 PO Box 340 (978) 386-7322 Fax Ashby, Massachusetts 01431-0340 Information Technology that Works for Your Business ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Date: 18 Jul 1998 15:29:21 -0700 From: "Andre_Campeau" Subject: Re: Talking Classic II >My guess is that you are missing a machine that is powerful enough to >give smooth speech. ;-) > >I guess I'll find out, though. I will be moving XTension to a Classic II >as soon as I get the machine - its on its way. Thanks Steve. Please let me know what happens. Andre Campeau Ottawa, Canada campeau@ottawa.com ---------------------------------------------------------------------- End of Digest To request a copy of the help file, reply to this message and put "help" in the subject. Subject: Digest for 7/19/98 Date: Sun, 19 Jul 1998 22:44:53 -0700 From: "XTension Discussion" To: "XTension Discussion" -> Re: going .... and going by Jeff Rothfus -> Range of a DM10 by Steve Fyfe -> Re: Talking Classic II by Sean McMains -> LynX communications problems by Mark Hartman -> New Release by michael@shed.com -> Re: Talking Classic II by Nathan Gardner -> Re: New Release by "Mitchell S. Cohen" -> Re: Talking Classic II by "Andre_Campeau" -> Re: Talking Classic II by Sean McMains -> Re: Range of a DM10 by Greg Satz -> Re: Talking Classic II by Keelan Lightfoot -> Emailer Script Working! by Steve Zimmerman ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Date: 19 Jul 1998 07:04:41 -0700 From: Jeff Rothfus Subject: Re: going .... and going Count my vote for preserving the 68k mac. On 7/19/98 5:43 AM you wrote: >The logic of separating the functions means that likely you can continue >to have the XTension 'host' on the old Closet Mac, and do the agent >thing on your newest iMac or G5.... > >But regardless of what crashes on the G5, the little old Mac in the >closet just keeps going.... > >enuf, any comments ? The 68k ability is one of 'The Best Features' of XTension. Let's not forget: We all are experimenters and tinkerers. As such, we are far more likely than the average Joe to want to tie-up a G3 to turn on a light bulb. For XTension to succeed as a consumer product, it must address the needs of consumers, who "just want it to work". To interweave threads a bit, isn't the primary reason batteries are included on-board the CM11, so that a PC can be *disconnected*? For whatever reason, consumers don't want to leave their computers turned on. X-10 addresses this problem (aka: consumer need) with on-board batteries. Sand Hill addresses this problem with a twelve-dollar headless server in the closet. The dual application approach seems like a great way to have our cake and eat it too: A G3 for bells, whistles, and experimentation; a 68k-in-the-closet, for some sort of assurance that the lights will be on when we return from vacation. Cheers, jeff ____________________________________________ Jeff Rothfus saranac.tv@worldnet.att.net ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Date: 19 Jul 1998 08:50:57 -0700 From: Steve Fyfe Subject: Range of a DM10 Can anyone suggest a way to increase the range of a DM10 motion detector? It works fine when it is 5 feet away from the transceiver, but if I put it more than 30 or so feet away (outside the house), then no signal comes through. I thought maybe I could add a piece of wire as an antenna, but I have not idea where to connect it. Can anyone tell me how to do that? Any other way to get the job done? Thanks Steve _____________________________________________________________ Steve Fyfe Windward Services Group (978) 386-7260 PO Box 340 (978) 386-7322 Fax Ashby, Massachusetts 01431-0340 Information Technology that Works for Your Business ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Date: 19 Jul 1998 10:49:57 -0700 From: Sean McMains Subject: Re: Talking Classic II Hi Andre, I would think that the Macintalk 2 voices would treat you ok, but the Macintalk 3 voices tend to be significantly more processor-intensive. Running them on a Classic may just be too much to ask! (I think they're choppy on my PB140.) If you have some RAM in your classic, you might try the Macintalk Pro voices. They require a lot more RAM, but aren't as hard on the processor. Sean >I'm trying to get XTension to talk on my Classic II but the speech is >very choppy. >Should I be getting a good enough speech off the Classic and if yes, what >Extensions/Control Panels should I be using? I have MacinTalk 2 and 3, >Sound Manager, Voices folder and Speech Control Panel. Would I be missing >something? > >Thanks. > >Andre Campeau >Ottawa, Canada >campeau@ottawa.com ============================================================================= Sean McMains (sean@techconsulting.com) | Mail sent to this address may be http://www.techconsulting.com/sean/ | published at my discretion. - ----------------------------------------------------------------------------- This message may be PGP-signed. http://www.pgp.com/ ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Date: 19 Jul 1998 12:12:02 -0700 From: Mark Hartman Subject: LynX communications problems Hi, everyone, I'm back - somehow I got unsubscribed. Talking to Paul Stary on the phone I found out that he and Phil were having problems with LynX communications. I have had no such problems. Comparing settings with Paul, I noticed that he had no handshaking set for his LynX; I have DTR & CTS set, and have no problems. Could this be it? ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Date: 19 Jul 1998 14:17:19 -0700 From: michael@shed.com Subject: New Release Hi Folks, I've just posted a corrected version ... 2.0.1 I've always believed that it's bad luck to release an even numbered version, and this was no exception... This version fixes some bugs in 2.0 concerned with DIM/BRI commands from a 'manual' controllers which can send function codes without an address. This led to problems with the understanding about just how to handle things like a DIM command to a housecode which was 'out of the blue'...Like someone just goes to a MiniController and punches "DIM" without selecting a Unit... But, I've tried to allow for cases where you want deliberately to 'stack' addresses (or want to use the PR511's ability), as well as to 'emulate' how real X-10 modules would respond to manual commands. PLEASE: Even though this version does a 'better' job, it doesn't mean that I think that this is the final answer to all of the possible cases that can be created with manual mini/maxi controller commands. (See "Dims and the single LynX") But, I believe that this is the right direction... PS: This version includes the "size-able Script Editor Window"... As well as some corrections to the handling of 'future value' in the DIM/BRI cases. It IS advisable that you throw away your XTension Prefs file before running this version. In general, things are very stable with version 2.x, there are just a few little tweaks that need be done... PS: pointer to the new version are from the home page. michael ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Date: 19 Jul 1998 17:20:01 -0700 From: Nathan Gardner Subject: Re: Talking Classic II Yes the Macintalk Pro voices would be best for the Classic. And, as with all processor intensive functions, if you can, turn off virtual memory and networking, they are those little no-seeums that can get ya. On Sun, 19 Jul 1998, Sean McMains wrote: > Hi Andre, > > I would think that the Macintalk 2 voices would treat you ok, but the Macintalk 3 voices tend to be significantly more processor-intensive. Running them on a Classic may just be too much to ask! (I think they're choppy on my PB140.) > > If you have some RAM in your classic, you might try the Macintalk Pro voices. They require a lot more RAM, but aren't as hard on the processor. > > Sean > > >I'm trying to get XTension to talk on my Classic II but the speech is > >very choppy. > >Should I be getting a good enough speech off the Classic and if yes, what > >Extensions/Control Panels should I be using? I have MacinTalk 2 and 3, > >Sound Manager, Voices folder and Speech Control Panel. Would I be missing > >something? > > > >Thanks. > > > >Andre Campeau > >Ottawa, Canada > >campeau@ottawa.com > > > ============================================================================= > Sean McMains (sean@techconsulting.com) | Mail sent to this address may be > http://www.techconsulting.com/sean/ | published at my discretion. > ----------------------------------------------------------------------------- > This message may be PGP-signed. http://www.pgp.com/ > > > > > ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Date: 19 Jul 1998 17:21:07 -0700 From: "Mitchell S. Cohen" Subject: Re: New Release >PS: >This version includes the "size-able Script Editor Window"... >As well as some corrections to the handling of 'future value' >in the DIM/BRI cases. Yeay!!! *ahem* ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Date: 19 Jul 1998 19:58:46 -0700 From: "Andre_Campeau" Subject: Re: Talking Classic II >I would think that the Macintalk 2 voices would treat you ok, but the >Macintalk 3 voices tend to be significantly more processor-intensive. >Running them on a Classic may just be too much to ask! (I think they're >choppy on my PB140.) > >If you have some RAM in your classic, you might try the Macintalk Pro >voices. They require a lot more RAM, but aren't as hard on the processor. You were right. The Macintalk 3 is the culprit. It works much better with Macintalk 2 or Pro. Thanks for the info. Would you know where I can get more voices? Thanks. Andre Campeau Ottawa, Canada campeau@ottawa.com ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Date: 19 Jul 1998 20:09:30 -0700 From: Sean McMains Subject: Re: Talking Classic II Unfortunately, Apple has never released an SDK for voices, so I think what you get from them is pretty much what's available. There are rumors of a Renaissance in progress in their Speech team, but I haven't heard anything definite yet. The only voices I know of that aren't part of the basic install are higher and lower quality versions of the Macintalk Pro voices, which take more and less RAM respectively. They're available from Apple. Sean >>I would think that the Macintalk 2 voices would treat you ok, but the >>Macintalk 3 voices tend to be significantly more processor-intensive. >>Running them on a Classic may just be too much to ask! (I think they're >>choppy on my PB140.) >> >>If you have some RAM in your classic, you might try the Macintalk Pro >>voices. They require a lot more RAM, but aren't as hard on the processor. > >You were right. The Macintalk 3 is the culprit. It works much better with >Macintalk 2 or Pro. >Thanks for the info. >Would you know where I can get more voices? > >Thanks. > > > >Andre Campeau >Ottawa, Canada >campeau@ottawa.com ============================================================================= Sean McMains (sean@techconsulting.com) | Mail sent to this address may be http://www.techconsulting.com/sean/ | published at my discretion. - ----------------------------------------------------------------------------- This message may be PGP-signed. http://www.pgp.com/ ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Date: 19 Jul 1998 20:52:50 -0700 From: Greg Satz Subject: Re: Range of a DM10 I had a bit of trouble with this as well, especially trying to get it through my outside walls. I had to take into account where my walls were double thinkness as well as other electrical appliances (AC, etc.) that were nearby outside. I sent a note to this list and found out that not all transmitters (DM10s) and transceivers are the same. I found that changing transceivers also helped. Greg At 11:50 AM -0400 7/19/98, Steve Fyfe wrote: >Can anyone suggest a way to increase the range of a DM10 motion detector? > >It works fine when it is 5 feet away from the transceiver, but if I put >it more than 30 or so feet away (outside the house), then no signal comes >through. I thought maybe I could add a piece of wire as an antenna, but I >have not idea where to connect it. Can anyone tell me how to do that? Any >other way to get the job done? > >Thanks >Steve > >_____________________________________________________________ >Steve Fyfe >Windward Services Group (978) 386-7260 >PO Box 340 (978) 386-7322 Fax >Ashby, Massachusetts 01431-0340 > Information Technology that Works for Your Business ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Date: 19 Jul 1998 20:59:05 -0700 From: Keelan Lightfoot Subject: Re: Talking Classic II > You were right. The Macintalk 3 is the culprit. It works much better with > Macintalk 2 or Pro. > Thanks for the info. > Would you know where I can get more voices? Have you tried the two mexican voices? Because they're configured to speak mexican, they sometimes add unusual twists to english :) Also, if you want to add varation to any macintalk voice, try commands like: I always wanted to sing like [[pbas +8]] Franki Valli [[pbas -8]] or talk as fast as [[rate +600]] a cattle autcioneer [[rate -600]] Some people have managed to have macintalk sing songs using these commands (Daisy Daisy, Happy Birthday) - -Keelan Lightfoot ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Date: 19 Jul 1998 22:08:36 -0700 From: Steve Zimmerman Subject: Emailer Script Working! Thanks for your help Mitch! XTension can now notify me at work when something occurs at home. I was unable to send the log directly, however, I first had to duplicate the file and then send the copy. I can't wait to show my Windoz co-workers, they don't know what they're missing! I still need to find (an easy) a way to disconnect the PPP connection. Apple does include a "PPP Disconnect" script with OT that I could use, but I'm not sure how to tell PPP to disconnect from a remote machine. Can Claris Emailer disconnect the connection? thanks for your help everyone, Steve Zimmerman szimmer@nfis.com ---------------------------------------------------------------------- End of Digest To request a copy of the help file, reply to this message and put "help" in the subject. Subject: Digest for 7/20/98 Date: Mon, 20 Jul 1998 22:44:32 -0700 From: "XTension Discussion" To: "XTension Discussion" -> Insight on X10 communication by -> Dimming problems by -> Re: Insight on X10 communication by michael@shed.com -> Re: Dimming problems by michael@shed.com -> Re: Emailer Script Working! by Steve Fyfe -> Re: Insight on X10 communication by Steve Fyfe -> Re: Dimming problems by Steve Fyfe -> Another version ! by michael@shed.com -> Repeaters by joe -> Re: Another version ! by michael@shed.com -> Re: on this day by mfjlaw -> Re: Insight on X10 communication by petitg@llb.saclay.cea.fr (Petitgrand) -> Re: Repeaters by Steve Fyfe -> Re: Repeaters by joe -> Re: Repeaters by Guy K Hillyer -> delays by Guy K Hillyer -> Re: Repeaters by Steve Fyfe -> Re: detecting power outage by Gunsmoke Engineering ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Date: 20 Jul 1998 00:28:31 -0700 From: Subject: Insight on X10 communication I have been collecting this list for two years but have only recently started to revisit XTension and have searched the list for help on various topics. Today, I read many posts regarding signal problems with CM11 and X10 in general, and feel compelled to comment. I have professionally installed a number of X10 based home lighting systems over the past 8 years, some in houses as large as 20,000 sq. ft., as an adjunct to the entertainment systems I design and install. I have never used an amplifier/repeater. Here's why: While many X10 devices continue working with signal levels below 25 mV, I generally don't consider communication to be reliable below 100 mV. In order to get this kind of level around a large house, you can either jam tons of signal into the head-end (which should ALWAYS be at the main breaker panel), or you can resolve the attenuation factor on the line at the 125 kHz X10 operating frequency. It's important to understand comm problems from the standpoint of attenuation rather than noise, because if you have enough signal, the noise isn't a problem (i.e., good signal to noise ratio = reliable comm). The impedance of the power wiring at 60 Hz. is milliOhms (1000ths of an Ohm). But at 125 kHz, it's perhaps 1000 Ohms. This is why the X10 signal can live on the same wiring carrying 20 amps to your wall heater and still communicate. In fact, Leviton specs X10 as capable of operating over 30,000 feet of power grid with no loads between the devices. This presents its own set of problems in high density neighborhoods. Here in my area, over 10 homes share the same xfmr and, therefore, the same X10 signals. In order to keep X10 signal levels high, the impedance at 125 kHz. must remain high. There are a number of factors that can cause this impedance to drop... drastically! The most common is also the easiest to resolve. Eliminate the use of power strips with surge suppression built into them. These strips almost always have a .22 uF capacitor across the line. This drops the X10 impedance near the strip to less than 6 Ohms! A second one cuts it to 3, and so on. Additionally, almost all switching power supplies have across-the-line input filter capacitors (caps) that, like the power strip, shunt the X10 signals. Devices which have these kind of offending power supplies include: 1) Copy machines 2) Fax Machines 3) Other computer peripherals 4) Some TVs 5) Some AV equipment Many of these devices have across-the-line caps BEFORE the on-off switch so turning off the device makes no difference in the attenuation. You actually must unplug the device to eliminate the attenuation. By choosing to plug the interface into the power strip, the attenuation factor has much more impact because it is right across the interface. Even 20 feet of power wiring offers some degree of protection or isolation from the attenuation of the strip. Then by also plugging in your computer and peripherals into this same strip, each units attenuation factor further compounds the problem. You're lucky if you get 100 mV out of the end of that strip, let alone around the rest of the house. When we started investigating this many years ago, we designed and built an in-line isolator (series inductor) which allows 10 Amps of 60 Hz. current to flow with only 1% drop, while at the same time offers 15,000 Ohms of series impedance at 125 kHz. Plug your surge-suppressed power strip into this isolator and then plug all offending devices (like your computer) into this isolated strip and the attenuation is ELIMINATED from the power wiring. The other important aspect of maintaining good levels is to always source the X10 signals from the interface at the main breaker panel. This is the lowest impedance point in the system and, hence, is where the noise and attenuation is the least. Furthermore, troubleshooting attenuation is facilitated by simply throwing breakers. Using the Leviton test set, open all breakers except the ones going to the interface and phase coupler, and measure the level in the panel. It should be 5+ Volts. Then, start making the other breakers, one at a time, and watch the level. If it drops, you have attenuation in that branch. Stop there, throw open all other branch breakers except the one you are troubleshooting, and start unplugging stuff on that branch. Have a helper watch the level at the panel and when it jumps up, you've found an offender! Plug this device into an isolator and move on to the next. Sourcing at the main panel is not so easy unless you plan this in construction. However, it should not be that expensive to have an electrician install an outlet inside your home near the breaker panel where you can locate the interface (TW523 or CM11). Then put your Mac nearby. If you can't locate the Mac close to the interface, it may be possible to extend the serial bus with CAT 3 or better, 2 twisted pair phone cable, using surface-mounted RJ-11 modular jacks at each end of the twisted pair cable with standard flat wire modular cords between the jacks and the computer and interface. Has anyone ever tried extending the serial interface in this manner? If so, how far? I will try this soon and report. Ken Victor's comments about the poor design of the TW523/CM11 serial comm may make this idea impractical, if true. Using these techniques, you can make any system work well without amplifier/repeaters. Using amplifiers, rather than dealing with the source of the problem, may come back to haunt you, since as you continue to add new devices to your home's electrical system, attenuation may increase to the point where even the amplifier can't cope. Understanding which types of devices are likely attenuators and using an isolator will ensure your system keeps working over the years. And, you can always add the amplifier. It will work even better without the attenuation. Now, all you have to do is talk me into making these isolators available to XTension users. They would obviously not be UL, cost around $20, in a plug-in wall transformer package with grounded outlet exiting the bottom, black, FOB Newport Beach, CA. If there is enough interest, I will certainly consider this. Meanwhile, I have received many great ideas and solutions from the list and consider the above information a small payback for all the help you have given me. ========================================================================= Paul E. Stary Fax: (949) 854-3457 Audio-Video Engineering Email: pestary@ix.netcom.com Voice Mail: (949) 646-8877 AOL: audvideo@aol.com ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Date: 20 Jul 1998 00:29:47 -0700 From: Subject: Dimming problems I use several 4-button wall controllers for scene lighting. By defining four units for the controller, I can use XTension's ON and OFF scripts for the four units to execute 8 scene commands (4 ON and 4 OFF). Here is the contents of the OFF script for one of the controller's units, although it has the same problem in the ON script. This script is used to restore night lighting levels to two lights that have been raised to 100% in the ON script. Since I am using simulated preset dimming on these lights, I need to turn them off (force them to level 0) before raising them from level 0 to ensure the light is the same brightness. Dimming down from 100% to 40% DOES NOT yield the same light level as brightening up from 0, as has been discussed here previously (due to tracking errors in X10). turnoff "Lite A" brighten "Lite A" to 40 turnoff "Lite B" brighten "Lite B" to 40 This rather straightforward script doesn't work!!! Light B continues brightening past 40% all the way to 100%. There is a slight hesitation after reaching 40, then it continues to increase. If I switch Lite A for Lite B (the order), the last light always winds up at 100%. However, if I insert another string of dims in between the two sets of commands above, the last light stops at 40%, the correct result. This resolves the problem... turnoff "Lite A" brighten "Lite A" to 40 turnoff "Dummy" -- Must be dimmable unit with HCUC and simulated preset dim enabled turnoff "Lite B" brighten "Lite B" to 40 If the unit "Dummy" is not set to dimmable and simulated preset dimming, so there is a string of dims sent to reach 0 level, then "Dummy" does not resolve the problem and "Lite B" winds up at 100%. I have tried executing this script in a global script and the same error occurs. Has anyone run across this kind of anomaly? ========================================================================= Paul E. Stary Fax: (949) 854-3457 Audio-Video Engineering Email: pestary@ix.netcom.com Voice Mail: (949) 646-8877 AOL: audvideo@aol.com ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Date: 20 Jul 1998 04:58:46 -0700 From: michael@shed.com Subject: Re: Insight on X10 communication Thanks Paul WOW ! What a great post ! I would like to post this along with the troubleshooting pages on the site..... Please? The best part of this message is that it is certainly logical that removing the 'noise' is just as effective as improving the signal strength. And now if we can just find a way to offer Paul's isolators ! Thanks for taking the time to write such an informative message. michael ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Date: 20 Jul 1998 05:29:05 -0700 From: michael@shed.com Subject: Re: Dimming problems Hello Paul, This sounds like you are invoking a 'feature' of X-10 devices. IF both "Lite A" and "Lite B" are set to the SAME HOUSECODE, then both will respond to DIM/BRI/ON/OFF's that are sent to that housecode. This will continue until some Other Housecode is sent ! This is an artifact of the 'stacked address' capability. IE: Send the address of several units with the same housecode. Then send one of (DIM/BRI/ON/OFF), and Each of the units will respond ! This may be 'cute' in a system with no computer, or few devices, and we have talked about deliberately using this technique on demand in XTension, but it can really be an 'overly-helpful' thing... It's neat to be able to Brighten up several lamps all at once, but if you have many motion sensors or other autonomous devices, then it is probable that one ON from a motion sensor in the middle of selecting the units to DIM, will cause all of the units that were selected, to be 'deselected' and thus won't 'track' the following commands. In your example, it doesn't work like you want until you do send a command to any address which is on another Housecode, in between the two Lamp commands. This has presented some very confusing problems with users in the past, and certainly has caused me a lot of worry trying to find the reason. In my system, this is very unusual since I have a lot of sensors going off all the time, so it is only very seldom that I actually see two or more lamps respond to the command that I meant for only one. It sounds like XTension should be doing something to help in this problem, but I haven't figured out a way to keep XTension from becoming part of the problem. Any ideas? michael ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Date: 20 Jul 1998 05:50:57 -0700 From: Steve Fyfe Subject: Re: Emailer Script Working! Steve Zimmerman said on 7/20/98 1:08 AM >I still need to find (an easy) a way to disconnect the PPP connection. >Apple does include a "PPP Disconnect" script with OT that I could use, >but I'm not sure how to tell PPP to disconnect from a remote machine. Can >Claris Emailer disconnect the connection? Yes, Emailer can disconnect. Here is the script I use with Emailer for checking my mail. You can modify this so that it makes the mail item for the log file just before it tells emailer to check mail. HTH Let me know if you need any help. Steve - --**** Begin Script - -- Internet using OT PPP - -- Stripped down version with no interaction for call from EMailer - -- Requires: - -- - Claris Emailer 1.0v2 or later - -- - A version of OT PPP property kRANoError : 0 property kRAPortBusy : -7114 property RetryErrors : {-6020, -6023, -6021} - -- No Answer = -6023 (ISP has problems with not answering sometimes) - -- No Modem Signal = -6021 (ISP has modem problems sometimes) - -- No Dial Tone = -6020 (Line in use for voice call) - --on run --for testing inside Script Editor try -- Establish a PPP connection to the Mail Server -- Check to see if the connection is already open, copy it to WasOpen copy (PPPIsOpen()) to wasopen if not (wasopen) then set retryCount to 10 repeat until (PPPIsOpen()) or (retryCount = 0) try with timeout of 3 * 60 seconds PPP connect -- connect with all defaults end timeout on error errString number errNumber if errNumber is in RetryErrors then --if ((errNumber = -6020) or (errNumber = -6023) or (errNumber = - -6021)) then set retryCount to retryCount - 1 |delay|(30) --delay for 30 seconds else error "PPP connection not opened: " & errString number errNumber set retryCount to 0 end if end try end repeat -- If still not open, let EMailer try to get the mail anyway. If -- PPP option for "let application connect" is -- on, EMailer will attempt to connect again. Either way, if it --cannot get the mail it will create an error log entry. end if -- Send queued messages and check for new mail with timeout of 9999 seconds -- Give a large timeout to ensure the connection finishes tell application "Claris Emailer" -- Connect to service called "Internet". -- The argument that is used with "connect to" can be either the -- name of the account or the name of the service to connect to. -- You may call this as many times as necessary. connect to "Internet Connection" with sending and checking end tell end timeout -- Shutdown the PPP connection, unless it was already open. if not (wasopen) then try PPP disconnect on error end try end if on error errorString number errNumber -- Something went wrong. --display dialog "Error: " & errorString if PPPIsOpen() then try PPP disconnect on error end try end if end try - --end run on PPPIsOpen() set connectStatus to state of GetPPPStatus() return ((connectStatus = "connecting") or (connectStatus = "connected")) as boolean end PPPIsOpen on GetPPPStatus() try set status to (PPP status) on error -- display dialog "Could not obtain the status of PPP." end try return status end GetPPPStatus on |delay|(numSeconds) set theTime to (current date in seconds) set endTime to theTime + numSeconds if (front application) is application "Claris Emailer" then activate application "Finder" repeat until theTime N endTime activate (front application) --give time to other apps set theTime to current date in seconds end repeat -- WaitTicks (60 * numSeconds)--hangs if Emailer is hidden end |delay| - --****** End of Script _____________________________________________________________ Steve Fyfe Windward Services Group (978) 386-7260 PO Box 340 (978) 386-7322 Fax Ashby, Massachusetts 01431-0340 Information Technology that Works for Your Business ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Date: 20 Jul 1998 05:51:17 -0700 From: Steve Fyfe Subject: Re: Insight on X10 communication PEStary@ix.netcom.com said on 7/20/98 4:28 AM >Now, all you have to do is talk me into making these isolators available >to XTension users. They would obviously not be UL, cost around $20, in a >plug-in wall transformer package with grounded outlet exiting the bottom, >black, FOB Newport Beach, CA. If there is enough interest, I will >certainly consider this. This sounds like a great device to have. If it is so easy, why is this product not available as a UL approved device from some major mfg? Is it possible that some of the commercial "noise block" products also provide this isolation? I don't mean this to be a criticism, just a question. Steve _____________________________________________________________ Steve Fyfe Windward Services Group (978) 386-7260 PO Box 340 (978) 386-7322 Fax Ashby, Massachusetts 01431-0340 Information Technology that Works for Your Business ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Date: 20 Jul 1998 05:52:24 -0700 From: Steve Fyfe Subject: Re: Dimming problems PEStary@ix.netcom.com said on 7/20/98 4:28 AM >This rather straightforward script doesn't work!!! Light B continues >brightening past 40% all the way to 100%. There is a slight hesitation >after reaching 40, then it continues to increase. If I switch Lite A for >Lite B (the order), the last light always winds up at 100%. However, if I >insert another string of dims in between the two sets of commands above, >the last light stops at 40%, the correct result. [snip] >I have tried executing this script in a global script and the same error >occurs. Has anyone run across this kind of anomaly? What version of XTension are you using? _____________________________________________________________ Steve Fyfe Windward Services Group (978) 386-7260 PO Box 340 (978) 386-7322 Fax Ashby, Massachusetts 01431-0340 Information Technology that Works for Your Business ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Date: 20 Jul 1998 08:45:08 -0700 From: michael@shed.com Subject: Another version ! Hi Folks, I promise I'm not doing this deliberately... Still studying the effects of the manual DIM/BRI commands, and I found that it was possible to make create even more confusion than I had thought. And while testing, I found a bug in the receiving of those new "Preset Dim" commands...reporting incorrect address. I hope that this will be the last 'release' for a while :-) This one's called 2.0.3, and it is now on the downloads page. michael ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Date: 20 Jul 1998 09:07:08 -0700 From: joe Subject: Repeaters What is the right usage of signal repeaters? I have to decide if this is what I need rather than another transceiver. Does the repeater work on only one house code or multiple house codes? Is the repeater meant to be placed near the MS12A's that the transceiver is having trouble picking signals up from? Joe ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ joe@gbgraphics.com http://www.gbgraphics.com ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Date: 20 Jul 1998 09:25:38 -0700 From: michael@shed.com Subject: Re: Another version ! Hi Folks, Well, I should have said that version 2.0.3 works great with the CM11.... I'm still not getting good behavior with the LynX and these manual commands. still in work michael ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Date: 20 Jul 1998 10:38:50 -0700 From: mfjlaw Subject: Re: on this day Your thoughts on the state of home automation and how it's being marketed and used by the public touch similar topics in other areas of "helper applications". Take AppleScript for example. When you first get into it, you try to do all sorts of tasks which are later discarded, as they serve no essential function and merely add a bell or whistle and eventual clutter. After your develop and trash scripts, you come up with a set of scripts very personal to the way you work and how you think, really allowing the computer to be your personal extension. The Desktop and how you organize it is another example of how a computer can become a personal extension. We all know what its like to get on someone else's computer and feel that your invading someone's privacy (i.e. by accessing their personal extension). You just can't get that type of personality with prepackage scripts/softwre unless you want to allow your working personality to formed by others (such as MS and AOL). You mentioned certain HA functions you now feel you can't live without, but to get there, I'm sure you had HA things happening in your home which now seem to have been a waste of time and energy. This is the fault I see in the huge HA packages and why we have comments from consumers like "I can't use it". Without having the ability to tweak and personalize the system (and having access to support groups such as this to get new ideas), those systems remain static and non-personal, and later to be discarded like any other toy once you grow out of it. I think what we'll see is HA systems such as the those described in this group and attached to personal computers (which already have attained the status of personal extensions) do a slow creep into individual lives, and that the system which will provide the most flexibility (including allowing the ability to tweak all aspects of the system and built-in extendability from 3rd party software and hardware) will be the survivor. Just some thoughs. Mark Johannessen ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Date: 20 Jul 1998 10:44:00 -0700 From: petitg@llb.saclay.cea.fr (Petitgrand) Subject: Re: Insight on X10 communication Really one of the greatest post I saw on this list ! It will probably exhaust the question for a long time ! Especially that it mention these curses of capacitors directly connected to the power line. Sometime these capacitors are also connected to ground, which can make a sensitive differential circuit breaker to trigger. Just a remark on: > The impedance of the power wiring at 60 Hz. is milliOhms (1000ths of an > Ohm). But at 125 kHz, it's perhaps 1000 Ohms. I have some doubt on this last figure. If you think to a 100 Watts bulb on a 110 V line, it has an impedance of 120 Ohms (frequency independant since it is a resistive load). If you have a dozen of these, then the impedance of your line is more likely 10 Ohms. Not really insurmountable for the X10 transmitter since it only requires 10 mA to get 100 mV. > If you can't locate the Mac close to the interface, it may be > possible to extend the serial bus with CAT 3 or better, 2 twisted pair > phone cable, using surface-mounted RJ-11 modular jacks at each end of the > twisted pair cable with standard flat wire modular cords between the > jacks and the computer and interface. Has anyone ever tried extending > the serial interface in this manner? If so, how far? This is precisely one of the advantage of the Mac to work with RS422 instead of RS232. The differential signal allows very long serial cables (up to 1000 ft in principle). For that you must keep the 4 signal wires. But does the interfaces (CM11 or LynX) keep the full feature of RS422 or do they work with a pseudo RS232 with only 2 wires ? Thank you Paul Daniel Petitgrand ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Date: 20 Jul 1998 11:49:14 -0700 From: Steve Fyfe Subject: Re: Repeaters joe said on 7/20/98 12:17 PM >What is the right usage of signal repeaters? I have to decide if this is >what I need rather than another transceiver. Does the repeater work on >only one house code or multiple house codes? Is the repeater meant to be >placed near the MS12A's that the transceiver is having trouble picking >signals up from? I have not used a repeater, so if I say anything that is incorrect I hope someone will correct me. The blurb that describes the repeaters in one of my catalogs specifically says that it can be used for all house codes at the same time. The whole idea with a repeater is that it picks up signals from devices near the repeater, like MS12's, and sends the radio signal again with a stronger signal that can reach farther. Since the repeater gets power from the house current, it can send out a stronger signal than the MS12 which is battery powered. The alternative is to use a second tranceiver, but in that case you would have to use a different house code to avoid collisions - if both trancievers picked up the same signal from a MS12 and sent the same x10 command at the same time, they would collide on the power line and neither would get through (although the tranceiver may be smart enough to prevent this, but if that is so, I am not aware of it). In my house I happened to get two tranceivers, so I am using both of them but on different housecodes. It works fine, at least for the transmitters that are near enough to one tranceiver or the other. HTH Steve _____________________________________________________________ Steve Fyfe Windward Services Group (978) 386-7260 PO Box 340 (978) 386-7322 Fax Ashby, Massachusetts 01431-0340 Information Technology that Works for Your Business ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Date: 20 Jul 1998 15:21:10 -0700 From: joe Subject: Re: Repeaters >In my house I happened to get two transceivers, so I am using both of them >but on different housecodes. It works fine, at least for the transmitters >that are near enough to one tranceiver or the other. Thanks for the reply Steve. I can't believe how short the range is for the one transceiver I have at my place. It must be because the walls are plaster and lath as opposed to drywall. I would have thought that radio frequencies could travel through walls easily enough. So it would seem that having a repeater wouldn't be a bad idea even if down the line I decided to add other transceivers. Joe ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ joe@gbgraphics.com http://www.gbgraphics.com ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Date: 20 Jul 1998 15:22:15 -0700 From: Guy K Hillyer Subject: Re: Repeaters The RF repeater really does, well, repeat the commands it receives. I tried one a few months ago, before I had XTension, and found that the doubling of commands made it impossible to control DIM/BRI with any precision. I would always overshoot the level I was aiming at. So I unplugged the repeater and forgot about it. Now that Michael has revealed the braindamage of DIM/BRI, I resolved not to send DIM/BRI commands from my wireless remote. So today I decided to give the repeater another whirl. If the addressed unit has no script associated with it, XTension's log shows the command doubling that I'd suspected. On the other hand, if a repeated command triggers an XTension script that in turn sends an X10 command, the script's action is delayed for about ten seconds! I hypothesize that this happens because the script tries to send its command at the same time that the second copy of the original command is being received at the CM11, and XTension detects the impending collision and backs off for a while. In this case, XTension's log does not show the second copy of the command. I'd like to use the repeater because it makes my wireless commands a lot more reliable. But a ten-second delay between pushing a button and having the light come on is too much. It would drive my wife nuts. Before I tried the repeater, I had a notion that it would just amplify the RF signal instantaneously rather than receive, pause, and then resend. Oh well. -- Guy joe writes: > What is the right usage of signal repeaters? I have to decide if this is > what I need rather than another transceiver. Does the repeater work on > only one house code or multiple house codes? Is the repeater meant to be > placed near the MS12A's that the transceiver is having trouble picking > signals up from? > Joe > > ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ > joe@gbgraphics.com > http://www.gbgraphics.com > > ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ > > > > > > > > ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Date: 20 Jul 1998 17:44:31 -0700 From: Guy K Hillyer Subject: delays Speaking of delays, I find that sometimes, even in the absence of a repeater, it can take five or six seconds from pushing a button to having an XTension script turn on a light in reponse. What is likely to be the cause of that delay? I'm running with a CM11 and a PowerBook 170. I thought at first that it might be because the Mac had to spin up the disk, but now it's set never to spin down the disk or "rest" the processor and I still see the delay. After a delayed response, commands sent shortly thereafter get more timely responses. Could this have something to do with the CM11? ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Date: 20 Jul 1998 18:50:55 -0700 From: Steve Fyfe Subject: Re: Repeaters Guy K Hillyer said on 7/20/98 5:49 PM >The RF repeater really does, well, repeat the commands it receives. I >tried one a few months ago, before I had XTension, and found that the >doubling of commands made it impossible to control DIM/BRI with any >precision. The repeater is designed to extend the range of wireless transmitters. You would position it between the transmitter and tranceiver. The idea is that the transmitter and tranceiver are too far apart to communicate. If that is the case, the tranceiver would only receive one signal - the one from the repeater. It is apparant from your experience that using the repeater to try to boost a signal does not work well if the tranceiver can get the signal directly from the transmitter too. joe said on 7/20/98 5:26 PM >So it would seem that having a repeater wouldn't be >a bad idea even if down the line I decided to add other transceivers. Given Guy's experience, you may be better off with two tranceivers, as long as it is not a problem to use two different housecodes. If that is a problem, you might try experimenting with moving the tranceiver to several locations to see where it works best. Steve _____________________________________________________________ Steve Fyfe Windward Services Group (978) 386-7260 PO Box 340 (978) 386-7322 Fax Ashby, Massachusetts 01431-0340 Information Technology that Works for Your Business ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Date: 20 Jul 1998 21:35:59 -0700 From: Gunsmoke Engineering Subject: Re: detecting power outage At 8:49 AM -0700 on 7/17/98, Steve Fyfe wrote: > Guy K Hillyer said on 7/17/98 10:12 AM > > >I have XTension running on an ancient powerbook so it doesn't >notice > >when there is a power failure. Is there some easy way to >send an X-10 > >command when the power comes back on, so that XTension can >know that > >it happened and take some action? > > Get a low voltage wall wart and hook the output to a >Powerflash unit. Set > the Powerflash to send an x10 when it senses the voltage. Hmmm... I wonder how the Powerflash is supposed to work when there's no 120VAC carrier signal (remember, the power just went out!). Maybe there's something in the Powerbook you can check via Applescript to tell when it transitions to battery power. Otherwise, APS makes UPSs that, when rated at over 400 (Watts?) have incorporated into them a serial interface that outputs a ttl signal that can be tracked by a Powerflash. In this case, you plug a powerstrip into the UPS, and the Powerflash into the powerstrip, so that you get power after the mains go down. You'll want to put the Lynx or CM11 into the powerstrip also, and make sure it isn't one of the filtered strips, for reasons mentioned in another recent post. The APS UPS I just purchased was about $135, and it lasts about 15 minutes when running my headless MacII. Somewhere in the archives you'll find a phone dialer script that will send a page in response to an alarm condition. I use the script to signal when the power goes down, among other things. Hope this helps, Scot Marburger - -- Scot Marburger @ Gunsmoke Engineering http://gunsmoke.com Email:scot@gunsmoke.com Ruger 10/22 Accuracy Specialist and Internet Services ---------------------------------------------------------------------- End of Digest To request a copy of the help file, reply to this message and put "help" in the subject. Subject: Digest for 7/21/98 Date: Tue, 21 Jul 1998 22:44:45 -0700 From: "XTension Discussion" To: "XTension Discussion" -> Re: detecting power outage by Steve Fyfe -> Re: detecting power outage by Steve Fyfe -> Re: detecting power outage by michael@shed.com -> Re: detecting power outage by Steve Fyfe -> Re: Repeaters by joe -> Re: Repeaters by joe -> Re: delays by joe -> Re: Another version ! by michael@shed.com -> Re: Insight on X10 communication by Phil Pedersen -> Re: delays by michael@shed.com -> Re: delays by Guy K Hillyer -> Re: Another version ! by Steve Fyfe ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Date: 21 Jul 1998 04:49:08 -0700 From: Steve Fyfe Subject: Re: detecting power outage Gunsmoke Engineering said on 7/21/98 12:20 AM >>>when there is a power failure. Is there some easy way to >>>send an X-10 >>>command when the power comes back on, so that XTension can >>>know that >>>it happened and take some action? >> >> Get a low voltage wall wart and hook the output to a >>Powerflash unit. Set >> the Powerflash to send an x10 when it senses the voltage. > >Hmmm... I wonder how the Powerflash is supposed to work when >there's no 120VAC carrier signal (remember, the power just went >out!). The question was - how to detect the power going ON after it failed. ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Date: 21 Jul 1998 06:49:49 -0700 From: Steve Fyfe Subject: Re: detecting power outage Gunsmoke Engineering said on 7/21/98 12:20 AM >Otherwise, APS makes UPSs that, when rated at over 400 (Watts?) >have incorporated into them a serial interface that outputs a >ttl signal that can be tracked by a Powerflash. My APS UPS has a serial connector on the back that can be connected to the serial port on a computer that is running APS's software that detects power outage. Do you know what pins I should connect to in order to connect the UPS to a PowerFlash? TIA _____________________________________________________________ Steve Fyfe Windward Services Group (978) 386-7260 PO Box 340 (978) 386-7322 Fax Ashby, Massachusetts 01431-0340 Information Technology that Works for Your Business ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Date: 21 Jul 1998 07:06:26 -0700 From: michael@shed.com Subject: Re: detecting power outage Steve Fyfe wrote: > My APS UPS has a serial connector on the back that can be connected to > the serial port on a computer that is running APS's software that detects > power outage. Do you know what pins I should connect to in order to > connect the UPS to a PowerFlash? Hi Steve, Have you got any info about the serial data or the connector ? It may be 'transmit only', and it may have 'handshake' lines, and it may already have just a simple contact output. Look at the application docs and see just what it is that it says in the event of power up/down, and that should give us an idea of what data it is acting on? michael ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Date: 21 Jul 1998 08:50:00 -0700 From: Steve Fyfe Subject: Re: detecting power outage Sand Hill Engineering said on 7/21/98 10:07 AM >> Do you know what pins I should connect to in order to >> connect the UPS to a PowerFlash? > >Have you got any info about the serial data or the connector ? >It may be 'transmit only', and it may have 'handshake' lines, >and it may already have just a simple contact output. > >Look at the application docs and see just what it is that it >says in the event of power up/down, and that should give us >an idea of what data it is acting on? Well, in order to get the info you asked for, I had to RTFM. Now, guess what - the answer to my question is right there in the book! Thanks for making me think! _____________________________________________________________ Steve Fyfe Windward Services Group (978) 386-7260 PO Box 340 (978) 386-7322 Fax Ashby, Massachusetts 01431-0340 Information Technology that Works for Your Business ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Date: 21 Jul 1998 09:22:43 -0700 From: joe Subject: Re: Repeaters >Given Guy's experience, you may be better off with two tranceivers, as >long as it is not a problem to use two different housecodes. If that is a >problem, you might try experimenting with moving the tranceiver to >several locations to see where it works best. This looks more like the way I should go. It'll probably save me plenty of frustration. Thanks for the reply, Joe ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ joe@gbgraphics.com http://www.gbgraphics.com ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Date: 21 Jul 1998 09:23:02 -0700 From: joe Subject: Re: Repeaters >I'd like to use the repeater because it makes my wireless commands a >lot more reliable. But a ten-second delay between pushing a button >and having the light come on is too much. It would drive my wife nuts. > >Before I tried the repeater, I had a notion that it would just amplify >the RF signal instantaneously rather than receive, pause, and then >resend. Oh well. This is reason enough for me to shy away from such a device. I don't need more flack from my wife while tring to get a reliable system going in the home! :-) Joe ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ joe@gbgraphics.com http://www.gbgraphics.com ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Date: 21 Jul 1998 09:23:52 -0700 From: joe Subject: Re: delays >After a delayed >response, commands sent shortly thereafter get more timely responses. >Could this have something to do with the CM11? You probably caught your CM11 on a coffee break. :-) Joe ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ joe@gbgraphics.com http://www.gbgraphics.com ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Date: 21 Jul 1998 10:52:04 -0700 From: michael@shed.com Subject: Re: Another version ! Hi Folks, I busted my chops to try to figure out what was wrong all of a sudden with the LynX version and Preset Dims. It turns out that the 'port switcher' that I had between the LynX and the Mac was disturbing the test. When I brought the LynX to the Quadra directly, I found that there wasn't anything wrong at all...works fine. So, the files that are posted on the downloads page are correct, even for the LynX : CM11: LynX: TW : There are some outstanding things: There is still a problem with the SE/30, and I assume the Classic II, that will absolutely crash the Mac if you try to manually Edit more than one scheduled event. And, the 'TwoWay' version does not yet have the ability to send or receive the X-10 Preset Dim commands. Otherwise, there is a small graphic 'artifact' that appears when you size the Script Editor window ... not erasing before redrawing... there's gotta be something to gripe about... :-) So far, this version has been stable, and there have been no reports of problems with the new features. And I've gotten several comments about the new size-able script editor window already... :-) There is still the outstanding problem report from a user who can consistently crash his Mac with a specific script that removes and creates scheduled events. Maybe this involves a level of recursion and/or indirection to which no one else has yet delved...? I believe that all others who are using the create/remove scheduled events verbs, (and maybe the new 'suspend until') are seeing that the problems they had been seeing are no longer there...? I am really hoping that this version will be the 'released' version for some time, and I can get back to spewing out beta versions again :-) And maybe I can get on to finding all the little tweaks that needs be for the PPC native version... Thanks again for all the help testing this version. michael ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Date: 21 Jul 1998 11:11:47 -0700 From: Phil Pedersen Subject: Re: Insight on X10 communication At 7:43 PM +0200 7/20/98, Petitgrand wrote: > Especially that it mention these curses of capacitors directly connected >to the power line. Sometime these capacitors are also connected to ground, >which can make a sensitive differential circuit breaker to trigger. As more electronic equipment is designed for world-wide usage, this problem should disappear. The newer standards used in Europe and now being harmonized with the US and Canadian standards limit the capacitance to ground and also line to line. This is making the manufacturers go to more expensive powerline filters that don't have the caps across the line as do older equipment and power strips. > This is precisely one of the advantage of the Mac to work with RS422 >instead of RS232. The differential signal allows very long serial cables >(up to 1000 ft in principle). For that you must keep the 4 signal wires. >But does the interfaces (CM11 or LynX) keep the full feature of RS422 or >do they work with a pseudo RS232 with only 2 wires ? If you look at the schematic of the Lynx at http://www.marrickltd.com/Files/SCH103.pdf , it looks like an RS-232 interface. Note that the Lynx supports hardware (RTS and CTS) handshaking and which should be used with Xtension. Otherwise, I've seen receive FIFO overrun errors on the Lynx, especially when I'm sending a long string of commands. Phil > ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Date: 21 Jul 1998 11:22:05 -0700 From: michael@shed.com Subject: Re: delays Hello Guy, I figured there would be some other responses, so I waited... I have to admit that I have not yet 'mastered' the settings of all of my PowerBooks, PB180c, PB190cs, PB5300 & PB5300c. I am also dismayed that sometimes it takes a 'very' long time to actually come alive and respond. This is particularly obvious when I have a SE/30, Q800, and two PB's running simultaneously, side by side, each with an X-10 interface... The Q800 and the SE/30 Always beat the PowerBooks...! I have tried pulling batteries and changing Control Panel settings, but as I said, I don't yet have the answer, but I do have the problem. It's even more obvious when a motion sensor triggers that causes a spoken announcement...the PowerBooks are always one or two seconds behind, and sometimes as much as 5 seconds. If it doesn't have to 'speak', the little SE/30 is very adequate for this purpose! michael ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Date: 21 Jul 1998 11:57:35 -0700 From: Guy K Hillyer Subject: Re: delays Hmm. Well I know that the PB powers down its audio circuitry when it's not in use for a while. You can hear a click when it turns on and off. That could explain the slowness of the speech synthesizer. I wonder if the same is true of the serial ports. michael@shed.com writes: > Hello Guy, > > I figured there would be some other responses, so I waited... > > I have to admit that I have not yet 'mastered' the settings > of all of my PowerBooks, PB180c, PB190cs, PB5300 & PB5300c. > > I am also dismayed that sometimes it takes a 'very' long time > to actually come alive and respond. > > This is particularly obvious when I have a SE/30, Q800, and > two PB's running simultaneously, side by side, each with an > X-10 interface... > > The Q800 and the SE/30 Always beat the PowerBooks...! > > I have tried pulling batteries and changing Control Panel > settings, but as I said, I don't yet have the answer, but > I do have the problem. > > It's even more obvious when a motion sensor triggers that > causes a spoken announcement...the PowerBooks are always > one or two seconds behind, and sometimes as much as 5 seconds. > > If it doesn't have to 'speak', the little SE/30 is > very adequate for this purpose! > michael > > --------------------------------------------------